Posted by: susanita | July 6, 2007

Coming back.

What do you call it when you trust someone and ask them for help and they don’t deliver, so you, in turn, turn your back on them stop trusting him/her? If the someone is a person, you feel they betrayed you and so you harbor a grudge against him/her. That’s pretty much a sin.  But, what if the person I turned my back on was not a person at all but rather God?  That’s pretty much a big sin.

I have been telling people that I recently made up with God.  Not in the traditional conversion sense, because I did that in 2002.  I made up with God in 2002 and started an intimate relationship with Him but somewhere along the path, I stopped trusting Him and turned my back on Him. My question is did I ‘fall away’ as Hebrews warns us not to do or what?

Hebrews 6:4-6  For in the case of those who have once been enlightened and have tasted of the heavenly gift and have been made partakers of the Holy Spirit, and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, and then have fallen away, it is impossible to renew them again to repentance, since they crucify to themselves the Son of God and put Him to open shame.

So, did I fall away or was I just estranged from God?

I may be using this Bible verse incorrectly but I am doing so intentionally because I want someone to tell whether what I did is defined as falling away or what? I have been reading in Hebrews a warning to not let yourself fall away, fall short of God’s grace, etc. What is the author talking about?  I have started to form an opinion that one can lose one’s salvation. My husband disagrees. But there are a several references in Hebrews to this.  Heb. 6:8 “but if it [the ground] yields thorns and thistles, it is worthless and close to being cursed and it ends up being burned.”

Doesn’t ‘burned’ sound a lot like hell?  Then in Heb 9:28 “so Christ also, having been offered once to bear the sins of many, will appear a second time for salvation without reference to sin, to those who eagerly await Him.”  Now, if you, as many have coined, prayed to receive Christ, BUT you are not eagerly awaiting Him, then Christ will not appear to you..??

I heard someone say that heaven is a place where God is number one and everyone there lives to worship and serve Him so….if you dont live to worship and serve Him on earth why would God want you in Heaven…i mean, you just wouldnt fit it.  Or for that matter why would you want to be there if you don’t adore Him presently?   If you don’t know how to swim and could care less about learning, you wouldn’t buy a beach house would you?

Anyway, I am conflicted about this issue. Personally, it makes sense.  If you truly believe that God and Jesus are who they say they are in the Bible, your life is going to show it.

For if we go on sinning willfully after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, but a terrifying expectation of judgement and THE FURY OF A FIRE WHICH WILL CONSUME THE ADVERSARIES.  Hebrews 10:26-27

That’s pretty clear to me. I’m not attempting to silence the age-old debate of whether one can lose one’s salvation, but I am trying to understand all these references to it in Hebrews. And based on my understanding of them, if you don’t exhibit Christ-likeness throughout your life, then you have trampled under foot the Son of God, and…have insulted the Spirit of grace. (Hebrews 10:29)  And, therefore when you die, you will have to answer to God about that. If you led a life that insulted the Spirit of God’s grace, then why would God say, “Come in to my wonderful Heaven where grace abounds.”

I guess my concern is if I had died during my grudge against God would I have gone to Heaven?


Responses

  1. Susy Q! What an inspirational sister in Christ you are! I hope that my thoughts towards your last question will encourage your heart as much as you’ve encouraged mine with these blogs. In the past few months my pastor at church has been preaching on how much God loves us. At first I felt like yeah, yeah I know, For God so loved the world…..blah blah blah. Not that I took it quite so lightly but I certainly did not deem HIS love for me as being illogically, unconditionally, crazily, unchangingly in love with me (us); that I am the apple of HIS eye; that HE loves me beyond my understanding and human comprehension. GOD TRULY LOVES YOU AND ME no matter how wacky we are at times! After weeks and literally months of hearing these words it actually started to seep in. Now instead of thinking “oh I hope GOD’s not made at me for that thought I had” or “I know Jesus will always love me but I think that GOD’s mad at me today.” NOW, I know that GOD loves me no matter what! I agree with you when you talked about freedom from your july 6 blog of last year. I feel the freedom in knowing that GOD loves me. All of that to say that had you died during the grudge that you held against GOD would you have gone to heaven……? The answer that resounds in my heart and mind is no matter what we do, feel, think, say, in the future no matter how bad or even good for that matter does not change the fact that when we get to heaven the only thing GOD will be looking for is a middle man-the HOLY SPIRIT. If you’ve got HIM, no matter how you feel at the time, you’re in. If you don’t have HIM then, unfortunatley, you’re not in. That’s one of the gifts and the confidence we have of receiving JESUS in our hearts is that we’ll NEVER EVER have to question our eternal destiny ever again! The devil is messing with you when you question your eternal destiny. CHRIST is alive in you and no one can ever take HIM out of you. LET NOT YOUR HEART BE TROUBLED …..John 14:1!!!!!!!! You’re precious in GOD’S sight everyday, every hour and every minute! Love you, Kim

  2. Thanks Kim! You are a huge encouragement to me. Not just in this post but in our everyday life. I will be blogging more about my grudge against God later. Thanks, I do need to take God’s love to heart!

  3. You didn’t go the route of Hebrews 6. I think that text describes someone who never was regenerate but chose to play along for whatever reason, Judas would be an example.

    Heb 6 describes someone who knows the Truth, makes some sort of intellectual or emotional assent to it and plays along for any period of time (Judas did for 3 years) but ultimately rejects it.

    I know others interpret it differently but John 10:26 really clinches it…

    I’m thankful that you are coming back, we (not to mention our prayer warrior Mother) have been praying for the both of you.

  4. Romans 8:29-31 is encouraging here. It’s a guarantee that God will see you through to the end. You’re predestined->called->justified->glorified. No one can stop that process. Sure there will be times of discipline but Christ constantly intercedes for us. There is no condemnation for those who are in Him.

    1. Hebrews was written to folks who were close to making a committment to Christ but were shrinking back.
    2. If you did take it as a warning to folks who were already committed to Christ, Hebrews 6:6 implies that if they did lose their salvation, they could never get it back.

    More on 1. : If you look at this from a Jewish frame of reference (Hebrews is, afterall, written to Hebrews…) everything becomes clear. The contrast here is between Christianity and Judaism. The call is to leave the elementary pictures and ABC’s of Judaism and come to Christ who is the substance of all the OT was trying to show.

    I have a great message from… this preacher I’ve heard once or twice… :) if you’re interested.

    I’m also really glad you’re coming back. So sorry that I wasn’t there for you both during the difficult times but I’ll definitely be praying from now on.

  5. hola susy!

    wow! you return to blogging and get loads of comments! i am completely in agreement with what everyone has said here…your post reminds me of a discussion i had with several of the teenagers at our church.

    they asked how to know if they’ve committed the unpardonable sin (blasphemy against the Holy Spirit)…we ended up coming to the conclusion that if a person is concerned that they’ve committed that sin, then most likely they haven’t. because a person who has committed that sin is proud and is concerned with his/her own selfish desires – not concerned with God, not concerned with humility or repentance, not concerned with forgiveness and definitely not concerned with the state of their relationship with Christ.

    a person who “falls away” is also not concerned with God or with returning or making up with God. a person who wonders if they’ve ever fallen away because of sin or a period of sinning is in need of repentance that only God can offer, and will typically seek this forgiveness because of humility. and God will respond to the humble and contrite (James 4:6).

    when Christians who have struggled with sin or droughts in their walk with God ask the question of whether they have fallen away, it is a ploy of Satan’s – it leads to discouragement and doubt. if Satan can get you doubting and discouraged, you will be less effective in your service to God and others.

    Romans 8 is a GREAT chapter to read – you should try to read it weekly. most of all Romans 8:38-39 explains that NOTHING can separate us from the love of God that is in Christ Jesus our Lord. believe these words – they are truth and life to your soul!

    love ya!

  6. Wow, thanks for your replies. OK, so now you guys leave me a lot of homework. I think that putting Hebrews in the context in which it was written, helps me understand it better.

    Let’s see, Heb. 6, Jn 10:26, Rom.8:29-31, Rom 8 and James 4:6

    OK, I will read them and post later. Thanks you guys for your encouragement.

  7. Regarding Hebrews 6, ok so going back to v.6 “it is impossible to renew them again to repentance” so since i did repent and turn once again to God then I did not ‘fall away’.

    I have a question though, in verse 8, what are thorns and thistles? What do those look like in people?

  8. What a powerful passage Romans 8 is! Whew! I want to write about v. 35. I also saw what you meant, in v. 9 it says that anyone who does not have the Spirit of Christ does not belong to Him. I believe that I did receive the H.Spirit in 02′ therefore I did not ‘fall away’ like Hebrews 6 describes, but I was grudging God.

  9. romans 8 is great =) you should def write more about it…

    also, take a look at the life of david. he sinned (some would say majorly) but God continued to call him his own. SO many great people of the Bible had bad times in their lives but are what we could consider heroes of the faith (while you’re in hebrews look at chapter 11)

    people who produce thorns and thistles are those are do not produce fruit…they are like those who hear the word and do nothing with it, they do nothing for Christ. john 15 talks a lot about Christ being the vine and we are the branches – attached to Him, we will do lots of great things for Him and apart from Him, we will do nothing beneficial (thorns and thistles).

    i think there are definite ways that christians misrepresent the name of Christ, either on purpose or accidentally – and then unbelievers catch us in obvious states of sin and call us out (which is common) but that’s when repentance comes into play (and i’m sure laz and i will learn more about this as edson gets older!)

    you have the opportunity to produce fruit (encouraging others, witnessing, tithing, sharing with others, etc.) as long as you remain in Christ – it’s all for His name’s glory! the second we stray, for any reason, God’s name isn’t going to be lifted up and His purpose in our lives will not prosper. however, it does not mean He doesn’t love us. that won’t change – just our relationship with him.


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